Positions, positions...

[Yoda]

Some of you were looking forward to see some naughty pictures, you dirty minded farts! LOL!

Sorry to disappoint you. This is about watch adjustment in positions, SF240 to be precise. I have had a lot of conversations about adjustments over the years and more often lately, so I thought we should clarify some of the elements involved.

The most extensive adjustments would be: dial up, dial down, crown up, crown down, 3 o'clock, 9 o'clock, isochronism, hot and cold, 9 positions in all.

Mind that it can be a bit cumbersome to achieve the readings/adjustments a movement was marked with 70-80 years ago. It has most likely had a new staff, a new jewel, a new mainspring and been exposed to bad handling, the possiblities are many.

Now, some movements are marked "unadjusted", exactly what it means is beyond my knowledge. I assume that it is what it says, "unadjusted" in positions and not adjusted for temperature, but possibly for isochronism. We will of course still want to see a flat and round balance wheel, perfectly poised with no dead spots. A "naked" balance wheel seems to be able to run forever, that's what we want to see. It doesn't matter how much mass you put on the staff when you "dress" it, hairspring and roller, sometimes double roller, as long as the mass is kept as close to the center as possible.

Most/many chronographs are marked "unadjusted", think about that.

So, here we have a SF240 alarm clock movement, unadjusted..This doesn't mean that timekeeping is way off, it just means that it isn't reliable when exposed to extreme temperatures or awkward positions. It was made to run well crown down, for the KW movements the balance wheel would have the same position around 11-12 o'clock.
There are some difficulties in making a movement lifting the pallet arbor assembly as easy as letting it fall, that is the only aspect. The lift angle.

Advice, don't worry about readings like +10 dial up and -10 dial down, they will be equalized when turned up and down on a daily basis as a wrist watch. Skip being schocked when seeing weird readings in all the other positions, it just makes you go crazy, keep you awake at night and make you start tinkering - which you should not do! Throw away Kello and all other gadgets, grab a beer and take it easy! LOL!

Here it is, simple, as with all movements. If it keeps time, it is good enough, that's my philosophy after looking at these readings for years. Sometimes adjusting the microphone input is the solution. Cell phones and other sources will disturb the microphone as well.

Ok, if you have a movement/watch adjusted in positions, perhaps COSC certified, that's is a whole other story we won't handle here.

I have had movements with crazy readings on the timing machine, but for daily use they have performed very well. In those cases I place them on the bench and check them twice a day in up and down positions, most of the time it is enough to see if it is ok or not. It's a bit slower to check a movement this way, that's why I bought a timing machine, but sometimes it is better to just accept the old school method.

I am sure that some of the watchmakers here will chime in and enlighten us, I would welcome that very much as I could be completely wrong about some of this.

I know a few things about a movement running fast or slow, and how to regulate that without using the regulator and tampering with the hairspring and timing screws on the balance wheel, next time.

[Emilio]

Wow! That's a worthy piece of information.

I'm going to add this to the DIY guide.

[TimemiT]

Great read! I've read of laying watches a certain position to gain/lose secs, etc.

I'm curious lately how to lay the 240 builds as I see them gain minutes, and it makes sense! Then I should lay the watch with crown down, which would be "close" to the natural position of the movement inside the clock case?

[Yoda]

Yes, crown down would be the closest to the way they were fitted from the beginning. I was taught to always place a wrist watch crown up, don't ask why and I never asked either. Could be the lifting of the pallet arbor assembly again.

Gaining minutes a day can be everything from a light magnetism, in need of service or a hairspring with slight issues.

[tafari]

very intrested!

As I research before because of the marked unadjusted on unita 6497, I find out that back in the days movements where engraved wirh this unadjusted for exports to save taxes. but I don’t know if this is a true story

[Yoda]

very intrested!

As I research before because of the marked unadjusted on unita 6497, I find out that back in the days movements where engraved wirh this unadjusted for exports to save taxes. but I don’t know if this is a true story

Now that you mention it, I have also read that somewhere.

[straps68]

very intrested!

As I research before because of the marked unadjusted on unita 6497, I find out that back in the days movements where engraved wirh this unadjusted for exports to save taxes. but I don’t know if this is a true story

Now that you mention it, I have also read that somewhere.

I have read about "Unadjusted" being a tax saving measure only, more than once actually but can't offer any links. I am pretty sure that really cheap movements are unadjusted but I don't think that any premium movements such as an SF240 ever left the factory really unadjusted - maybe just less well adjusted?

[TimemiT]

I put that 240 build laying with the crown ... and it lost 40+ minutes in a couple of hours ... laying it flat seems to be best. I'll run the timer on it tomorrow.

Yes, crown down would be the closest to the way they were fitted from the beginning. I was taught to always place a wrist watch crown up, don't ask why and I never asked either. Could be the lifting of the pallet arbor assembly again.

Gaining minutes a day can be everything from a light magnetism, in need of service or a hairspring with slight issues.

[Yoda]

I put that 240 build laying with the crown ... and it lost 40+ minutes in a couple of hours ... laying it flat seems to be best. I'll run the timer on it tomorrow

The movement should do so much better than that. Is that the build you showed us a few days ago, the incastar movement?
Something is not completely right in there, has it been serviced?
Anyway, it is usually easy to correct gaining or losing in these, as long as the hairspring is good.

[erlendh]

Good info. I've tried some of these timing apps like Kello, and they never work for me, readings are all over the place. But old school works! Set the time. Wait. Check again in days/weeks and see how it is. (I use the app Watchtracker for that.)